there are 21 celebrations you have jsut turned around and stated cannot be considered Bonfire thanks to your arguement
well i hope you have fun just going to 2 CELEBRATION NIGHTS (mayfeild and lewes) the rest of us will enjoy the other 21 bonfire carnival hybrids
We are all out to have fun and raise money for charity and if you don't like it take a rookie shine it up nicly, turn it sideways and........
OH and to be honest you are causing more bad blood and bad feelings than the police of the anti bonfire biggots put togeather
--->
Only A JOKE . . I love all of the celebrations and have been to all of them many times over the years and they are all good in their own way . I never said I dislike or like carnivals or bonfires I have entered many fancy dress comps , played in marching bands . I even entered a float at Uckfield one year . By the way I wont be at Mayfield but might start the season at Burgess Hill as usual. Good Luck Tonight _________________ Remember Remember The Fifth Of November . . V
mayfield's got more martyrs and smugglers history than pretty much any sussex town other than lewes itself - and a few of them as got singed at the stake at "the home of bonfire" were from mayfield, too - so the tradition is as deep seated there as it can be. for good measure, and over a few beers, i'd argue the case that there's more smuggling history in mayfield than any other venue other than hastings (with honorable mentions to eastbourne rye, too, maybe)
unfortunately, the current celebrations with the embarrassing lack of an actual bonfire, and that detestable bloody fair, lump it firmly in the carnival category, but no-one with any genuine understanding of what the whole thing is really about can possibly say that mayfield is not, at heart, a 100% nailed on proper bonfire celebration, and always will be
it was acutally four in the village itself (hence the four burning crosses that lead the final part of the procession), plus another two residents of the village who were incinerated along with the other fifteen unfortunates at lewes
Thats interesting . . Always thought it was three martyrs . . You learn summik every day . . Gonna look into that . . Was it a good night guys _________________ Remember Remember The Fifth Of November . . V
A Bonfire Night is a Carnival and Carnival is a Bonfire Night when they remember the act of parliament passed by King James
An Act of Parliament (3 James I, cap 1) was passed to appoint 5 November in each year as a day of thanksgiving for "the joyful day of deliverance"
So that gives them the right to call there self’s a Bonfire Society
And what exactly is a Bonfire Society and a proper Bonfire Night
one that remembers the above act
Is has sod all to do with how many Martyrs where burnt at the steak whether in Lewes, Mayfield or anywhere else _________________ the only man to ever to enter parliament with honest intenions
Good informative post by Gabriel, surely V, "Bonfire" is actually about the gunpowder plot of 1605? and the whole Sussex Bonfire scene is based around the 1606 act of deliverance which is why it's timed around the 5th of November and not the 22nd of July when the first martyrs were burnt at the stake. That's not to say the 17 martyrs (plus, lets not forget the others burnt all over Sussex. i.e. Mayfield, East Grinstead etc) don't have their place in our celebrations, their courage and willingness to stand up for their beliefs against papist oppresion is an example to us all, you only have to read the accounts of their deaths to appreciate that, and how important it is for us to continue to remember them for future generations, because if we don't no-one else will. But ultimately Bonfire is based around the Gunpowder plot of 1605. As lbs points out, your attempt to drive a wedge into the heart of Bonfire by establishing an elitist hierarchy in Lewes with everyone else being non-runners will only further the goal of those who seek to stop us. We at HBS are firmly a Bonfire society, no floats, funfairs, carnival Queens, dance troups here and we do have fireworks in the processions but we will continue to support ALL our fellow Bonfire societies whatever their leaning, snobbery and elitism has no place in Bonfire, and is indeed the very thing we are fighting against!!! Hopefully I haven't offended anyone, I don't profess to be a Bonfire "expert" but I do know why I don my Guernsey every Saturday evening! _________________ Lest we forget
well said rockape but
[quote]That's not to say the 17 martyrs (plus, lets not forget the others burnt all over Sussex. i.e. Mayfield, East Grinstead etc) don't have their place in our celebrations
all of us remember the fallen of the war at our celebrations and lewes/mayfield also remember the martyrs as they came from that part of Sussex _________________ the only man to ever to enter parliament with honest intenions
Yep agree totally of course, I think I put in there that they should be remembered. As we all know the vast majority of the martyrs came from the surrounding towns and villages i.e. Mayfield, Brighton, Woodmancote, Ardingly, Warbleton, Heathfield, Rotherfield, Punnets Town etc, so I fail to see why societies from outside Lewes are not considered proper societies? Purely because they are outside Lewes. Surely their loss would have been as greatly felt as the people of our marvelous county town? _________________ Lest we forget
ultimately Bonfire is based around the Gunpowder plot of 1605
perhaps not "ultimately", as that would be like saying that the acts of remebrance for the wars were based around armistice day or the german surrender at rheims which might be perceived as defining single moments in a longer campaign simply because they were when it all came to an end
the gunpowder plot and subsequent act setting it's commemoration in stone were the culmination of a fifty year long period of unrest that started with mary's counter-reformation and the burning of the martyrs (wherever they were from, and wherever it took place) - i think the lewes societies, and to a lesser extent mayfield, are justified in making the events that took place at their specific locations more central to their celebrations simply because they may heighten awareness of the historical context of the plot, which is an obvious single point on which to base many celebrations, but which simply would not of happened at all without all the preceding goings on - let's face it, if armistice day was the sole point of reference for remembrance of the great war, you'd only be remembering those who fell on 11/11/18, and none of the millions who fell at cambrai, ypres, passchandael, the somme and so on, which would clearly be daft
i must admit that i've always taken it as read that sussex bonfire was very much based on the broader picture rather than specifically the november 5th goings on which are celebrated all over the country without any of the historical resonance that applies round these parts, hence the clergy getting pelted at newick and so on, or am i wrong ?
A Bonfire Night is a Carnival and Carnival is a Bonfire Night when they remember the act of parliament passed by King James
An Act of Parliament (3 James I, cap 1) was passed to appoint 5 November in each year as a day of thanksgiving for "the joyful day of deliverance"
Is has sod all to do with how many Martyrs where burnt at the steak whether in Lewes, Mayfield or anywhere else
bah - meant to quote the above, too, in my diatribe about "no gunpowder plot or act of parliament without the martyrs, so you can't possibly say that it has "sod all" to do with them".....
anyway, surely "burning at the steak" is more to do with barbecues than bonfire ?
Posted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 10:28 am Post subject: Re: Carnivals and Bonfires
i think this topic is get out of hand and away from the subject
we all have our views but let not forget it is meant to be fun so sod it if you are (Carnival / Bonfire or both ) lets just have fun doing our thing _________________ the only man to ever to enter parliament with honest intenions
Posted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 1:03 pm Post subject: Re: Carnivals and Bonfires
guyfawkesforpm wrote:
i think this topic is get out of hand and away from the subject
we all have our views but let not forget it is meant to be fun so sod it if you are (Carnival / Bonfire or both ) lets just have fun doing our thing
Ditto _________________ Fletching.
''Home of The Flame Bomb''
Thats my whole point . . . . Trying to work out why the Celebrations with all its bonfire/carnival societies only happen in Lewes & Sussex . . One would have thought the celebrations would have centred around westminster in london where the old houses of parliment stood if the celebrations was 100% based on the gunpowder plot. Theres more to it than that . . Mayfield (Formed 1556) proves that. There has been torch lit proccessions of sorts around late October - Mid November since around 500 AD in many parts of east sussex. No one is trying to drive wedges and as I said before all societies are good in there own way. Whether in Lewes or Sussex they all stand for Freedom Of Choice etc. _________________ Remember Remember The Fifth Of November . . V
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lets all just enjoy ourselves, and support each other 